Always been curious what it was like behind the scenes of the TV show Shark Tank? Wondered if ‘Mr. Wonderful’ was really as mean and nasty as the TV show depicts? Wondered how you could get your business featured on Shark Tank yourself? Well this episode covers all of those questions.
Listen To The Full Interview:
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On this week’s episode, we talk with the original Urban Beardsman himself, Eric Bandholz. Eric shares his experience pitching on ABC’s Shark Tank. We also discuss the process that he went through, what he learnt from the show and how the show has affected his sales and his profit. Tune in to hear all the tips Eric shares with Digital Exits.
What You’ll Learn From This Episode:
- How Eric got on Shark Tank
- How the Shark Tank Process works
- What each of the individual sharks were like
- The number 1 piece of advice that Mark Cuban gave him
Featured On The Show:
Jock: Welcome back to another episode of the Digital Exits podcast. I’m your host, Jock Purtle, and today we have the one, and the only, the Beardsman himself, Mr. Eric Bandholz.
Eric: What is going on, Jock?
Jock: So, before we start, can you give me your intro to every single YouTube video that you have, which I absolutely love?
Eric: Ok. Yeah. What’s going on, Internet? It is your boy, Eric Bandholz, back again with another awesome episode from Beardbrand. Hope all’s going well on the other side of the Internet.
Jock: Perfect. So today we’re going to be discussing how to get on Shark Tank. And you had the great opportunity of being on probably what is one of my favorite US TV shows. So I guess for everyone that doesn’t know you, quick background, who you are, where you’re from, and then a little bit about Beardbrand?
Eric: So as he already said, I’m Eric Bandholz with Beardbrand, and Beardbrand is a men’s grooming company that focuses primarily on beard care. We started and grew primarily through our online sales but have branched out into working with retailers and growing our wholesale line as well. So we manufacture our products as well as retail our products. And we’re a pretty young company. We’re just over two years of being in business and have bootstrapped our business to where we’re at today.
Jock: So I know your history in intimate detail, but you started out with a blog. And then that sort of progressed to an event, which was like a startup event where you met your founders, and then out of that spurned the ecommerce store, and I guess I want to, maybe let’s go into the Shark Tank pitch before we sort of go into numbers, and so, I guess we’ll start out with…what was the deal with Shark Tank? Did you reach out to them? Did they reach out to you? How did it all start?
Eric: So it’s probably a funny story. Lindsay, out of the blue, e-mailed me and was like, “Have you heard of this Mark Cuban guy?” And I’m like, “Yeah, he’s like only one of the most prominent businessmen in America and has done a lot of really cool things.” It was her first time. She ran into him talking down here in Austin, Texas, and just loved what he said, loved how he presented everything. I think it was after that that she did a little more digging and found out, of course that he was on Shark Tank, and she submitted an application for us to appear on Shark Tank. So we did it the old-fashioned way, we just filled out a form and e-mailed it on to their yahoo.com e-mail address.
Jock: (laughs) Good deal. So just for everyone, Lindsay’s your business partner. And so, it was just basically, saw Cuban speak, and then just decided to apply. Was there any thought that you’d get on? What was the mindset when you sent that e-mail?
Eric: So we’ve always, and this is probably, Jock, you know me. I’m a very humble guy. As a very humble guy, I kind of knew that our story was interesting and that no one was doing what we were doing. So I was pretty sure and pretty confident that we would end up on the show. I think we were doing some pretty cool stuff and making some waves and doing it in a way that a lot of other companies out there aren’t doing it. I thought we had a pretty good story to tell and a pretty legitimate shot of getting on there.
Jock: So before Lindsay sort of threw the idea of Mark Cuban at you, had you thought about applying before that?
Eric: Yeah, I don’t think there was a day that went by when someone said, “Hey, you should do Shark Tank.” “Hey, you should do Shark Tank.” We used to get that all the time. When we first came out with our business, Beardbrand, beard care was a total niche market. It did not exist before us. The concept of guys taking care of their beards was 100% new to probably 99.999% of people. So it’s those kind of really new ideas that like to be shown on Shark Tank. I think it was pretty clear that it was a new idea to a lot of people. Nowadays there’s a lot more competition out there for that. But definitely as we’ve grown, it’s been a standout organization.
Jock: Sure. Now I know there was a little bit of hesitancy from one of the partners in particular going on the show, so tell me about that. How did you weigh out the pros and cons?
Eric: There’s definitely a lot of risk of being on the show. As a business entrepreneur, and I would imagine that a lot of entrepreneurs relate to this, you like being in control. You control how you’re going to invest your money, what kinds of products you’re going to buy, who you’re going to hire. Everything’s within your grasp. But when you go on Shark Tank, you give up a lot of control. You almost give up all of the control. Like the whole process of getting on the show, you don’t have that control. If you film, you don’t have that opportunity of how they’re going to edit it, nor what the sharks are going to say or how they’re going to perceive it. All that is kind of outside your control. So you’ve got to put a lot of faith in there that the show’s got your best interests in heart and that they can accurately portray the events that happen when you’re up there for the pitch. So we were a little bit hesitant to that and the other thing that we were concerned about is up to our show, a lot of the contestants, I don’t want to say contestants, a lot of those entrepreneurs had almost been kind of kitschy ideas, like almost kind of gimmicky. We’re real serious about our product. We’re real serious about beard care, and changing the way society views beardsmen. This isn’t a joke for us, and we didn’t want to be perceived as a joke. So that was one of the big risks that we were weighing out as well. Would they be able to understand a company that’s worked hard to build a brand rather than just simply sell a gimmicky product?
Jock: Sure. Let’s run through the process. So you sent off the e-mail. Let’s work through some dates. So when did you first e-mail them your pitch?
Eric: That would’ve been, I think it was like, about May. I’ve got to get all these dates. May of 2014. No, I’m way off. That’s when we heard from them. We originally sent in our application in September of 2013.
Eric: It was very early. It was month number 8 of our business.
Jock: Between the time you sent the e-mail and you actually heard back from them, it was 8 months, is that right?
Eric: Yeah, it was from…
Jock: I just did the maths. Roughly 8 months.
Eric: I’ll trust you.
Jock: (Laughs) Good deal. That’s a long time, really. When do they do the casting for the season? Is it around that time? Why do you think there was such a delay?
Eric: Yeah so, I think what they’re doing now is…they’ve got a very scheduled, and I don’t know the schedule exactly, but there’s a time period when they’re out looking for new companies, there’s a time period when they’re filtering companies, there’s a time period when they’re preparing companies to come film, there’s a time period when they’re filming, and then, I’d assume, there’s a time period when they’re cutting everything up and editing it and producing it, and then there’s the show. So it’s just, there’s a lot of steps involved. They’re going to have 20 seasons, or 20 shows a season, and each season has what? Like, five shows, so you’re looking at like 100 companies that you’ve got to finagle all that together. So there’s a lot in the air, and it made sense to where they’re just…you know, when they’re looking for talent, they’re looking for talent. The rest of the time, they’re focused on everything else.
Jock: So they got back to you in May, and then you aired on the 31st of October ’14. And so, let’s run through the process. They e-mailed you back. What did they say?
Eric: Well, let’s talk about…there’s a few different ways that you can actually get in front of the team at Shark Tank, one of which is, of course, submitting an application like we did. And we only sent one application. We never bothered them. We trusted that they got it, and that if they were interested, they’d come back. They also do casting calls at various cities. I think they had one going on at SXSW, that we thought of going to, but from what I heard from other people, was that that’s when they’re looking for those real gimmicky type of businesses, the ones that they just do for comic relief and they kind of want to laugh you off the stage. And then, of course, the third way is to get an intro…or I guess, get an intro, or they come and they contact you. They have teams out there who are looking for cool businesses and they’ll go out and they’ll contact you directly. So there’s a few different options to get in there. So then we passed on this opportunity at SXSW. It was a couple weeks later that they reached out to us and told us that they wanted to take us through their process. Once you go through that, it’s just a lot more background checks. They want to make sure that you’re not lying about business, that your company is set up the way it’s set up, that someone else doesn’t have a patent for the products you’re selling, just…there’s no legal issue… As they say, they’re in CYA mode so they’re covering their asses and they want to make sure that anyone who gets put on there is going to be a good company. I say “good company,” but would be a non-suable company or company that’d get them sued.
Jock: Sure. So, May, they got back to you. Let’s walk through the process. So what was in that e-mail? What did they say? What did they want?
Eric: With that e-mail it would’ve been just, “Hey, we’re interested in moving forward with your show.” Fill out this more paperwork, sign more details about what your company is. It’s like an 80-page contract. Give you all the ins and outs of what to expect.
Jock: Gotcha. So basically, you’ve been run through their vetting process. You’re going to jump through all the hoops, you’re going to make sure you’re ticking all the boxes, which is basically verify financials and legals, etc…so how long did that process take before they’d done all their background checks and they gave you the green light?
Eric: It moves pretty quickly. Once you get into the system, it’s moving in like a day-to-day or week-to-week type of business. So they have deadlines for you. The deadline to get the contract in was like a week or two weeks. So we passed it along to our lawyer, our legal team, to make sure there was nothing that would really bite us in the ass. Once that gets signed off, then it’s getting all the patent search going…but during this process, they’re also working on your pitch. So they work with you to help optimize your pitch. Then you’ll record it constantly and kind of tweak it and improve it and make sure it really flows well from you and that it’s something they would feel confident putting on air.
Jock: So let’s go to the next date. May, you got the email. When was everything sort of wrapped up in regards to due diligence? What month was that?
Eric: I’m fuzzy between all these dates. I don’t know day-to-day. It took probably about a month to go through the whole background screening, the patent screening, the pitch perfection, and then bringing us out to record. We would move in…that would be, like, I think we recorded in June, that we would go in and record.
Jock: Oh, wow. So it was really fast.
Eric: Yeah, yeah, they put it all together, and I’m scrambling…like, you’re scrambling to build your set and piece it together. You’ve got to put a lot of time and energy into Shark Tank, so that’s the other risk that we always looked at. We could put in tons of energy and a lot of resources into it, and never get on the show. They’re very up front about that as well…there’s never any guarantee that you’re going to get on the show, so the investment that you put into getting on the show, take that in mind. You could pay thousands of dollars and have thousands of dollars of man-hours preparing yourself to be on the show and never get on.
Jock: So, they filmed in June. Is it right that they just film it in five days?
Eric: Yeah. I mean, it may be more days, it may be less days, I don’t know. But they bring in these groups of entrepreneurs, who you can’t talk with, because they want to keep everything confidential and quiet, and then, to be most efficient with the sharks’ times, that makes sense. So they’ll go in and shoot several episodes very close together.
Jock: Let’s talk about the pitch. Where do you have to go to? Who else was there? Was it really structured? Were you scared shitless? All of the above?
Eric: The actual pitch on the show…of course, it’s a TV production studio. I probably can’t give you the specifics of which studio. You arrive there, and when you have your time to be called, you get up and you make sure that your stuff looks the way that it should look, that your presentation for your stuff is all correct, and then they get it all set up, and they get you behind the doors, and your heart beats at like 500 beats per minute, and then they do open up the doors, you walk through it, and you stand on your spot and you start pitching to the sharks. The first time they ever heard about Beardbrand was the minute I walked through those doors. A lot of what they show on TV is real. The intensity is real, not necessarily because it’s just pitching to investors, but because it’s in front of 7 or 8 million people. And then you just go from there.
Jock: They did a little pre-roll for Beardbrand. Did they shoot that after you were in the tank?
Eric: With the pre-roll, yeah. They don’t know how the pitch is going to go, so they’ve got to kind of narrow it down after all the pitches are done and they get a feel for how they want to build their show. Then I think they’ll do the pre-roll from there. We were lucky enough that they selected us. They call them “at-home packages,” where they just kind of tell the story and give a little bit more detail about the entrepreneur or the business and what they’re doing. We were very fortunate to be able to get one of those shows as well.
Jock: How did it feel finding the “X marks the spot” for the TV set and then standing in front of all the sharks?
Eric: If you guys do a little more digging, this is out there as well, but you go in there, and you stand there for about 30 seconds as they get all their cameras set up in a line properly. Then I think…someone indicates that it’s OK to start your pitch. So it’s like this very awkward, quiet moment before you start pitching. It’s intense. It’s a very intense experience.
Jock: Were you surprised at how constructed it was just from the TV show element?
Eric: What do you mean by “constructed?”
Jock: The fact that you had to wait 30 seconds, the fact that they probably had pauses in between to change camera angles and all that good stuff?
Eric: First of all, there weren’t any pauses, so there’s no interruptions once you start going with them. They record everything. They do a really good job of preparing you for what to expect. So there’s no surprises as an entrepreneur. They lay out exactly how everything is going to work, where you’re going to stand, what’s going to happen. There’s no surprises. They also do a really good job of laying the expectations of being on the show and chances. They are, in my opinion, pro-entrepreneur. They’re not out there to screw you or do hit pieces or make you look bad. They’re there to share these stories of entrepreneurs who are out there who are passionate about what they’re doing. When you don’t do it every day, when you’re not a TV personality, I would imagine it’s kind of challenging. I feel like a lot of my YouTube videos almost prepared me for the experience.
Jock: There was a lot of prep that you did regarding the actual pitch. How much help did you get from the Shark Tank team in terms of structure, what you should say, and when you should say it?
Eric: They helped out a lot. My original pitch was immediately going into the numbers and kind of boastful and getting them excited. They had the idea of kind of leave them hanging, give them a little bit of a teaser, and that starts the questions from there. That’s what they want you to do, is start interacting with them.
Jock: Do you want to run through the rough structure that they had you go through?
Eric: It’s pretty basic. You say your name, you say your company, what you’re doing, and what makes you unique, and then what your valuation is. Kind of straight to the point. I would say those are the three core things that you want to knock out with your pitch.
Jock: How long was the actual spiel where you were talking with no interruptions?
Eric: They give you about two minutes
Jock: Really? So it’s like literally like two minutes worth of pitch and then like 43 minutes worth of questions.
Eric: Yeah. Exactly. They don’t really edit out…if you guys go and watch my pitch, they edited out a joke within my pitch. They made it seem like my product was a joke which was the only frustration I had with it. Beyond that, it was pretty much the pitch that you see on TV was my pitch.
Jock: Let’s talk about the questions. How long were you in the tank? About 45 minutes?
Eric: Yeah, time flies when you’re in there. You have no regulation of how long it is. But I think it was about 45 minutes.
Jock: All the questions they ask you don’t obviously see on the show. If you were going to categorize what style of questions you get bombarded with, do you want to sort of have a guess at what they were asking and why?
Eric: If you guys watch the show, the questions they ask are very on point. A lot of it is discovery of what the business is about, how you’re making money, and what the valuation is. Really, if they like you or they don’t like you and if they want to do business with you or they don’t want to do business with you? It’s just truncated down so they filter out the questions. A lot of them will be digging. For instance, they asked me about my numbers, and I broke it up into six-month run rates. Mark had a question if that was total or if that was over the course of the last six months or whatever it was. So there would be clarification e-mails that they were able to truncate based on how those questions were asked. They do do a good job of condensing a lot of information in an appropriate amount of time.
Jock: So the sharks don’t have a pre-list? They don’t have a one-pager at all before they see you? The first time they see you, whether that’s documents or live, is actually when you do the pitch. Is that right?
Eric: Exactly. So they’re not reading up on me, they don’t know anything about my business, my numbers, nothing. It’s just coming in and I’m chatting with them.
Jock: So what was the hardest question? What question stumped you the most?
Eric: I felt like I didn’t really get hung up on a lot of questions. A lot of the things I got were them just not understanding the market or the niche, and then not being able to effectively show them how many men out there currently wear facial hair. A little bit of what they did was they got hung up on our Beardsman kit, which is like our high-end, premium product. And we just brought it out there to kind of show the quality, but really, beard oil is our primary product. They kind of got hung up on the items within the Beardsman kit and I couldn’t get them focused more on the beard oil and our core product. So it wasn’t so much that the questions were hard, but it was wrangling in five fiercely independent and driven individuals. You’ve got to have a lot of controller mentality in there. You’re getting asked by five different people at the exact same time, and being able to know how to pick questions first and how to direct them and guide them so that they’re all moving in the right room. You’ve got to be an excellent person of controlling the conversation.
Jock: Who asked the most questions?
Eric: Kevin was in there for a while asking a bunch of questions. Mark asked some questions really early on, and then Daymond and I…we talked a little bit toward the end. Lori had some remarks, and I felt like Robert wasn’t really into it. I don’t think I got a lot of questions from Robert.
Jock: So you reckon, there’s a relationship between their interest level and the questions that they ask?
Eric: I would think so, and I think they were having fun among themselves as well. They seemed to be in good spirits and jovial so I let them have their banter between themselves as well.
Jock: Tell me about them individually.
Eric: It’s really tough to get to know someone within 45 minutes. In my personal impression, I think Kevin puts on this persona of the shrewd valuation type of guy, likes to lowball. That didn’t bother me at all because I kind of knew he was going to do that. I think that you see on air is pretty accurate with what I interacted with, so it’s hard for me to say that they’re any different or that I really even know them any better than someone who watches the show a lot.
Jock: Did they offer any good advice?
Eric: Yeah, I mean, Mark told me to just focus on beard oil individually and not focus on the Beardsman kit. Kevin told me to get ready to sell a bunch of Beardsman kits. Kind of passing words as I walked out the doors. If they had more advice, I missed it or I didn’t pick it up
Jock: Is Kevin as big of a dick as he’s made out to be on the show?
Eric: I didn’t think he was a dick at all there. I didn’t think he was a dick to me. But then again, I can separate the business aspect from the personal. So I think he was fine to me. He didn’t seem a dick at all.
Jock: Was the only access you got to the sharks on the show? Was there any access afterwards at all
Eric: Well, I did a little digging and I found Mark Cuban’s e-mail, and I shot him a quick e-mail that night just to thank him for his time and what he’s done with the show. He was kind enough to respond and shoot me a quick little message back with encouraging words. I couldn’t find the e-mails for the other team, so I think Daymond’s since favorited one of my Tweets. That was about the closest I’ve gotten to having another conversation with them.
Jock: Cuban’s known to post his e-mail address across the billboard at the Mavericks games so I’m sure it wasn’t that hard to find.
Eric: Yeah, he’s pretty accessible. I don’t know how he can respond to all those e-mails but I’m sure he gets a ton of them.
Jock: He’s a machine, just quietly on a side note, Cuban fan myself. That man’s incredible.
Eric: Yeah, he definitely has a lot of skills that I don’t have, that’s for sure.
Jock: So let’s talk about the deal. You didn’t get an offer. Why do you think there was no offer?
Eric: I think Cuban had a pretty valid reason for not investing. He saw this as being kind of a small market and capping out at $5 million. He only wanted to do bigger deals. I disagree with him, but if that’s what he sees, that’s what he sees. With Lori, she just didn’t understand guys having facial hair, which I thought was kind of odd because there’s definitely a fair amount. Maybe it’s just the markets I do where I see them, but she just didn’t understand the market. I kind of think Robert was maybe along the lines of he just didn’t see the potential in the marketplace. And then Daymond, probably if I’d got Daymond on another day I may have been able to get an offer from him or if maybe people were maybe if it went a little bit different way I think I might have been able to, but he was very down the fence. I thought he was going to go one way or the other. I think our valuation, what we did, we valued our business at like $400,000 for 15%. I would have done up to $400,000 for 20%. But $400,000’s still a lot of money and if nobody else was jumping in, that would’ve been all Daymond’s money. So it’s…I think that’s a lot for him to bite off without having like 100% certainty that he would able to get that back.
Jock: Sure. You know, we’ve had this conversation before, and we both agreed that there’s a correlation between when you’re pitching and at what time of day, and what day that you were pitching and getting a deal done. What day were you filming, and were you the last one or the second to last one of the day
Eric: They do it in phases, and I was at the end of the phase that we were in. I was there for five days. That day, I was also the 10th person to pitch. So I don’t know if they had just done a whole bunch of deals or if they’re tired or what was going on with them, or if they just wanted the day to be over. So there’s a lot of things like that that go into it that…it’s just that the human aspect of business and nature is…you want to get them in good spirits, you want them to…you know, give them some wine or something, get them loosened up a little bit and then deals will get done. So there’s a little bit of luck involved with that as well.
Jock: Do you regret not getting a deal done?
Eric: No, I mean, that wasn’t in my control. I thought going on to the show, I thought I had to prepare for handling multiple offers, because that’s what I thought was going to happen. We had some of the best numbers ever to be on that show and I thought, there’s no way, with the kind of numbers we’re bringing into the table, that they would, wouldn’t they even think of offering us. I was actually a little surprised that we didn’t even get an offer, and we would’ve, if they offered us, we would’ve done a deal.
Jock: If you really did want an offer, would you have changed the structure of the deal terms
Eric: Yeah. We pitched 15% and we would go up to 20% for that same amount, so we would take it down to a $2 million valuation.
Jock: All right, let’s talk about the after-effect. What does Kevin O’Leary call it, “The Shark Tank Effect?”
Eric: Is that what he’s calling it?
Jock: I think it’s “The Shark Tank Effect.” Anyway, I hear them talking about it all the time. The publicity and PR that you get from the show directly correlates to an increase in sales, doesn’t it? Doesn’t matter who you are or what you are, you get a whole bunch of publicity, and so, tell me about the results. I was sitting there eating pizza and we were looking at the traffic. It was pretty good. Do you want to share month before, month after? Lead up to it?
Eric: Yeah, it definitely was a killer experience and tons of exposure. I was very happy to be on it. But at the same time, it’s not ultimately going to make your business. You’ve still got to grow your business and beat the competition and stay above the crowd. It airs on a Friday, and then you’ll have, what you’ll do on Friday is going to be a really good day. What happens on Saturday is usually about the same. We hit it right before the holiday season, which is our peak period as well, so I think we kind of just fell into this whole season of nice performance. Ever since then, we’re on pace to do about 2X or 2.5X what we were doing last year. So it’s definitely been good for exposure but I don’t think all of our growth has been exclusive to the effect of Shark Tank. That’s…while it is, eight minutes or five minutes on national TV, that’s still only five or eight minutes. There’s a hundred and however many alumni of the show and you can’t name them all. So maybe they come up in your mind or maybe when you see something down the road it’s going to help with that, but it’s not going to be something where you get all this traffic and then all of a sudden you’re a billion dollar company. It doesn’t work that way.
Jock: Let’s talk specific numbers in terms of sales on that weekend, so the Friday-Saturday-Sunday, compared to the Friday-Saturday-Sunday before Shark Tank in terms of increases, because it was pretty significant.
Eric: We had like a $40,000 weekend with Shark Tank, and before that, I would imagine we were doing about $7,000 a day. So that would’ve been around a $14,000 or $20,000 weekend before. But I don’t have those numbers exactly in front of me.
Jock: It’s more than doubled. I remember looking at the Analytics data and it certainly did more than double and even that month, the month of November, was probably about double the month of October roughly.
Eric: So the thing is, a lot of your growth is going to depend on your current company size. I feel like we weren’t a small fish when we went on the show compared to a lot of the others. That “Shark Tank Effect,” if you’re only doing $25,000 a year, and then you’ve got this great idea that gets a lot of traction online, then yeah, you could go up and have a $25,000 weekend. But where we sat, we were already a little more established so we were able to handle the demand and our website didn’t go down and we didn’t really run out of inventory and all that stuff. I was expecting the whole world to end. So it all comes down to your perspective of where you’re coming in and where your business currently is at, on how much growth the show has to be. I would think that…I would expect to do an additional, probably $10-15,000 worth of sales more than what you normally do on individual days for the next couple days.
Jock: The growth you’ve seen since the show, could you attribute a certain percentage of sales purely from Shark Tank?
Eric: Maybe we could look at it, let’s see if I can do a quick Analytics and see how many people are searching for “Shark Tank” in the keywords. Maybe get a feel for what those conversions are. With Google Analytics getting rid of the whole…
Jock: SEO data’s a pain.
Eric: It’s not always the best. Let me see here…I’m sure I could do it, but it’s not…
Jock: Give me a gut feel.
Eric: Well, we’re doing 2X what we were doing last year, so I would imagine that a lot of that has to do with the effects of Shark Tank.
Jock: Anything else that you think is prudent to share regarding the process, how to get on it, any tips for anyone who wants to try?
Eric: My big thing would be to really listen to what the team is telling you. So if they’re giving you advice, take advantage of that advice. If they’re…you know, they’ve done this pitch for a lot of people. Don’t build your business around the opportunity of being on the show. It’s going to be…it’s almost like playing the lottery. You’re not going to be able to build your business by playing the lottery. You’ve got to build your business and then if something like this happens, then take advantage of it, but don’t let it be the defining thing that’s going to help you get to the next level.
Jock: Well, man, thank you very much. That was an interesting and fun exercise. If someone wants to reach out to you, if someone wants to buy some awesome beard oil, where should they go?
Eric: Of course our website is beardbrand.com, and if you’ve got any questions for me, Twitter is a great medium for me and that’s @bandholz, which is my last name.
Jock: Man, I’ll see you in Austin, soon. Thank you very much.
Eric: Great! Pleasure’s all mine, Jock.